Vietnam was a tragic mistake. A veritable shithole. I experienced it as a young Marine officer in 1966-67.
Seems everything we have touched since the conclusion of hostilities in 1946 has been a blemish on the character and integrity on our floundering Republic.
What exactly were the neo-con goals? I don’t believe they were the stated goals. I believe the real goals were largely achieved, the major one being severing the cheap Russian energy to Europe, thereby destroying European productive economy. To believe they made a mistake is as naive as believing KOVID jabs were safe and effective vaccines. When are we going to notice that Western Imperial Oligarchy is actively working on the destruction of its own domain? These aren’t just mistakes; they only look like mistakes from the people’s perspective.
Outstanding comment. 100% true. The war was a rousing success for those who pushed it. That tens of thousands of innocent Ukrainians were murdered does not register with our psychopathic elite.
The Vietnam war was started based on a lie propagated by the U.S. - The "special operation" in Ukraine was initiated by the U.S. via a $5 billion Obama supported coup in Kiev and by the U.S. intention of eventually moving nukes into Eastern Ukraine, on the Russian border. - In Vietnam, the U.S. deserved what it got; but, it was U.S. soldiers who paid the price. What will happen to the U.S. with regard to the current Ukraine conflict remains to be seen; but, given the U.S.'s track record, it's unlikely to be beneficial to ordinary U.S. citizens.
The ridiculous world order the US and West pretends exists has been fought over time and again since WWII and is the root of all the evil. The US can’t even keep its own cities in order, let alone the rest of the world. The bloviating state department, hapless DoD and criminal enterprise that is the 3 letter agencies have bankrupt the mom and pop businesses and their otherwise peaceful and orderly families. Isn’t it great to run the new world order?
There is a vast difference between Vietnam and Ukraine. I lived four years in the former, now 17 in the latter.
Vietnamese did not know communism. They did not trust their American allies. They were suspicious of our motives. They were internally divided. They had no strong leadership.
Ukrainians have lived under the Russians. As previously noted, we are not Russian, don't want to be Russian, and won't be Russian. We embrace our allies. We trust their motives. Ukrainians are united. We have strong leadership.
Over the centuries the Russians have conquered many peoples. None of them wanted to, or want now to be Russian. Follow the link to my Substack of today. Comment if you want. To get an earful, that is.
Eastern Ukraine is what the Russians have most wantonly destroyed. I have been to Donetsk, Mariupol, Berdyansk and Crimea. They all spoke Russian, as do I, and were happy to be Ukrainian. We in Kyiv have lots of refugees from those places the Russians have absolutely obliterated. They emphatically do not want to be Russian.
That's not what I've read and heard. Take your BS propaganda elsewhere. You sound like the U.S. corporate mainstream media.
After the U.S. supported 2014 coup, U.S. senators such as McCain and Graham began meeting with the neoNazis in the Western Ukraine government and funding weapons for them, which they used to shell Donbas, killing around 14,000 Eastern Ukrainians. The Eastern Ukrainians finally had enough and asked for Russia's help. Mariupol was loaded with Eastern Ukrainian solders who had to be routed. I expect the same for Berdyansk (I'll look at this later today); and, Russia's Black Sea fleet was already in Crimea, where 90 percent of the citizens voted to join with Russia.
Ah, how sweetly you write! BS propaganda. No, it is a different opinion, and an informed one. I have cited my sources. I don't expect your mind is open to be changed, so I'll put my energies elsewhere.
Thanks. You're correct about putting your energies elsewhere. I've closely followed the situation since 2014 and am totally with Eastern Ukraine and Russia/Putin on this.
Good and bad motives. Politics. There is a world-wide left-right axis, and the left has embraced Ukraine since our independence. Money to be made - see Hunter Biden. Careers to be made in NATO. Profits to be made in the arms business. Asses to be covered with regard to biolabs, etc.
Some have an honest interest in the well-being of the Ukrainian people. Disapora Ukrainians and people who lived in the Soviet satellite nations. Some like the Visegrad countries have always feared Russian aggression and (IMHO rightly) see this as the place to stop it.
The most valuable stuff I have posted is the historical stuff. Russia has been the same throughout its history. Read about the Mongol hoard. Read Custine, John Quincy Adams, John Hay, Homo Sovieticus and many, many more. Russia has no claim to eminence in any sphere except conquest. That's what they do. And have always done.
then why did the Azov battalion and other parts of the Ukrainian military spend 8 years, from 2014 until 2022, bombing and shelling Russian speaking Ukrainian CIVILIANS in eastern Ukraine, killing 14,000? If those Russian speaking eastern Ukrainians don't want to be part of Russia, surely they don't want to be part of Ukraine after Ukrainians were at war with them for 8 long years. The surprise is not that Putin invaded, the surprise is that he waited so long!
While we're on the subject, I listed a great many sources on Russian history in my post. I have posted reviews on my web site. Have you read them? Search on Russia-Ukraine. Since they pretty much cover the waterfront, several are perforce by Russophiles such as Stephen Cohen. Please come at me with an informed opinion.
Why did they? Answer to me is that they did not. That's Russian propaganda, spread by the likes of Gonzalo Lira, Thomas Roeper, Patrick Lancaster and Graham Phillips. Russia is generous with such people.
The UN's OSCE observer group was not allowed to actually see what went on. Russia had been planning this war for a long time, and they fueled the conflict to give them a reason. Such shelling certainly did not serve Ukraine's interests. The ongoing conflict was likely to lead to war, which it did. Everybody know that war would be a disaster for Ukraine. They tried to avoid rather than invite it.
close friend of mine has a Ukrainian friend who now lives on Whidbey Island (that's in Washington State where I used to live) who immigrated from eastern Ukraine. He still has friends and family there. According to him, the bombing and shelling of eastern Ukraine by the Ukrainian military was real, he has heard about it from his friends and family who are there.
Russia did not want this war. They wanted a guarantee that Ukraine would not join NATO and they wanted to get the Nazi's out of Ukraine. And I suspect they also wanted to shut down the 26 biolabs that were in Ukraine.
US told Russia in 1991 that we would not move NATO one inch east of Germany. Guess how many NATO countries there are today that are east of Germany.
Tell me, what would US do if Russia installed missile bases in Canada just north of our border and China installed missile bases in Mexico just south of our border?
Here's an irony. I just got crapped on by Taras Kuzio, an ardent Ukrainian patriot and ardent American leftist. He told me to piss up a rope when I tried to interest him in answering Carlson's interview. I should be PO'd. However, it prompted me to reread my 2017 review of his book "Putin's War Against Ukraine." He called it a war in 2017, and it was. I suggest that you read this long review. It has stood the test of time.
I challenge the notion that Russia did not want this war. They wanted the war in 2014 and this one as well. Read my review of Alexander Dugin's "Fourth Political Theory," link below. Russia is and has always been expansionist.
I and most of us did not thing NATO was a good idea for Ukraine. We were not close to joining. It is now a bad idea simply because there are no enemies other than Russia. Moreover, the EU is a bad idea. If the leaked dialog I see is correct, Putin quite rightly mocks it in his Tucker interview.
Ukraine of course had nothing to do with who was admitted to NATO. We still don't know the history of the biolabs. The Ukrainian people certainly did not know about them. They were a bad idea, but not a reason to go to war.
As to the shelling, I am sure that Ukraine shot back when provoked. They had total control over what the denizens of Luhansk and Donetsk heard on the news, so I'm not surprised that's what they believed. Russia has even been known to carry out false flag operations.
I think that Putin is NOT wanting the New World Order, so if there is a chance to weaken what Putin is, what he does, the NWO people will take it. Putin does not want to give his power over to the NWO people. Not that I think It is right that Putin invades other countries though, but this is about slamming Putin.
Well, the disaster for the Thousands of Tribes and Nations caused by the Anglo-Franco-Iberian viral load coming to this country has never been reckoned with. It just has been exported as pain and gain and theft and murder and enslavement by the AmeriKKKans and now those in the Wailing Wall White House.
Forget neo-con, neo-liberal. The average (what's that) American is gung ho! Don't you know?
Jobs producer, these wars. And, in the room temperature IQ of the average Yanqui, it is all part of their orgasm. Empire of death, terror, chaos, theft, misery.
Uh, the first time you are learning of the plight of the farmer in Europe, Judge? Perhaps the judge should consider paying attention to alternative news sources. I'll bet Judge Napolitano has since realized that this was one of those tellingly-embarrassing admissions of the unacceptably uninformed, at least on some important topic. (I have done it myself. It does not feel good.)
Back to the principal topic, my heart is absolutely breaking. If, or rather when, we survive this--and that will not come without great suffering--we must figure out how to prevent plutocrats from gaining the power that they currently do---the power that we have permitted them to have. Their initial turn into solipsism self-reinforcingly accelerated unimpeded into madness. Because we live in a partly material realm, there is momentum to these processes.
First their lost of reasoning becomes irrational according to accepted rules, mores and then legal and constitutional strictures. Their wealth allows them to think and to behave--without seeming consequences--"way outside the box." Then irrationality progresses to practical arationality once their own combined whims, impulses and desires for gratification (carnal or intellectual) become the only term in the numerator of all ratios, all benefit-to-cost analyses. As cost goes to the limit of zero, the fraction becomes undefined. They are living in a new economic realm, they become like transactional gods. The plutocrats' hope that their economic Olympian heights will magically encompass that of the biological.
It will not. Their magic is illusory. It would be wise that they not believe their own trickery. The apparent suspension of natural and Divine law merely tightens a giant spring. It is the spring of the Logos.
If that is true, and why lie about it, than I'm just gobsmacked. What am I doing knowing anything? Little ole' uneducated housewife me somehow has her own centralized intelligence agency in her head and it is a lonely place.
Just like Vietnam the Ukraine conflict has gone exactly as planned. The money follows a circular path and returns to the Industrial Military Complex.
Not only that but the companies hired to rebuild Ukraine will make billions. And onto the next war we all go.
Until Trump shuts off the fake dollars and arrests them all!
Vietnam was a tragic mistake. A veritable shithole. I experienced it as a young Marine officer in 1966-67.
Seems everything we have touched since the conclusion of hostilities in 1946 has been a blemish on the character and integrity on our floundering Republic.
What exactly were the neo-con goals? I don’t believe they were the stated goals. I believe the real goals were largely achieved, the major one being severing the cheap Russian energy to Europe, thereby destroying European productive economy. To believe they made a mistake is as naive as believing KOVID jabs were safe and effective vaccines. When are we going to notice that Western Imperial Oligarchy is actively working on the destruction of its own domain? These aren’t just mistakes; they only look like mistakes from the people’s perspective.
Outstanding comment. 100% true. The war was a rousing success for those who pushed it. That tens of thousands of innocent Ukrainians were murdered does not register with our psychopathic elite.
Same for the COVID Pandemic
https://substack.com/profile/22354262-jwm_in_va/note/c-48533322?r=db4nq
Because it's the same people
No, they are psychopaths.
How many deaths are Neocon Victoria Nuland and her husband, Neocon Robert Kagan (architect of the war on Iraq) responsible for???
The Vietnam war was started based on a lie propagated by the U.S. - The "special operation" in Ukraine was initiated by the U.S. via a $5 billion Obama supported coup in Kiev and by the U.S. intention of eventually moving nukes into Eastern Ukraine, on the Russian border. - In Vietnam, the U.S. deserved what it got; but, it was U.S. soldiers who paid the price. What will happen to the U.S. with regard to the current Ukraine conflict remains to be seen; but, given the U.S.'s track record, it's unlikely to be beneficial to ordinary U.S. citizens.
The ridiculous world order the US and West pretends exists has been fought over time and again since WWII and is the root of all the evil. The US can’t even keep its own cities in order, let alone the rest of the world. The bloviating state department, hapless DoD and criminal enterprise that is the 3 letter agencies have bankrupt the mom and pop businesses and their otherwise peaceful and orderly families. Isn’t it great to run the new world order?
There is a vast difference between Vietnam and Ukraine. I lived four years in the former, now 17 in the latter.
Vietnamese did not know communism. They did not trust their American allies. They were suspicious of our motives. They were internally divided. They had no strong leadership.
Ukrainians have lived under the Russians. As previously noted, we are not Russian, don't want to be Russian, and won't be Russian. We embrace our allies. We trust their motives. Ukrainians are united. We have strong leadership.
See my Substacks, starting with today.
https://grahamseibert.substack.com/p/why-pay-attention-to-tucker-carlson
You must be in western Ukraine, with a putz for a president. Eastern Ukraine is mostly Russian and they want to be Russian.
Over the centuries the Russians have conquered many peoples. None of them wanted to, or want now to be Russian. Follow the link to my Substack of today. Comment if you want. To get an earful, that is.
Eastern Ukraine is what the Russians have most wantonly destroyed. I have been to Donetsk, Mariupol, Berdyansk and Crimea. They all spoke Russian, as do I, and were happy to be Ukrainian. We in Kyiv have lots of refugees from those places the Russians have absolutely obliterated. They emphatically do not want to be Russian.
That's not what I've read and heard. Take your BS propaganda elsewhere. You sound like the U.S. corporate mainstream media.
After the U.S. supported 2014 coup, U.S. senators such as McCain and Graham began meeting with the neoNazis in the Western Ukraine government and funding weapons for them, which they used to shell Donbas, killing around 14,000 Eastern Ukrainians. The Eastern Ukrainians finally had enough and asked for Russia's help. Mariupol was loaded with Eastern Ukrainian solders who had to be routed. I expect the same for Berdyansk (I'll look at this later today); and, Russia's Black Sea fleet was already in Crimea, where 90 percent of the citizens voted to join with Russia.
Ah, how sweetly you write! BS propaganda. No, it is a different opinion, and an informed one. I have cited my sources. I don't expect your mind is open to be changed, so I'll put my energies elsewhere.
Thanks. You're correct about putting your energies elsewhere. I've closely followed the situation since 2014 and am totally with Eastern Ukraine and Russia/Putin on this.
Graham, why do you think US-UK-EU-NATO axis is so obsessed with this conflict?
Good and bad motives. Politics. There is a world-wide left-right axis, and the left has embraced Ukraine since our independence. Money to be made - see Hunter Biden. Careers to be made in NATO. Profits to be made in the arms business. Asses to be covered with regard to biolabs, etc.
Some have an honest interest in the well-being of the Ukrainian people. Disapora Ukrainians and people who lived in the Soviet satellite nations. Some like the Visegrad countries have always feared Russian aggression and (IMHO rightly) see this as the place to stop it.
The most valuable stuff I have posted is the historical stuff. Russia has been the same throughout its history. Read about the Mongol hoard. Read Custine, John Quincy Adams, John Hay, Homo Sovieticus and many, many more. Russia has no claim to eminence in any sphere except conquest. That's what they do. And have always done.
then why did the Azov battalion and other parts of the Ukrainian military spend 8 years, from 2014 until 2022, bombing and shelling Russian speaking Ukrainian CIVILIANS in eastern Ukraine, killing 14,000? If those Russian speaking eastern Ukrainians don't want to be part of Russia, surely they don't want to be part of Ukraine after Ukrainians were at war with them for 8 long years. The surprise is not that Putin invaded, the surprise is that he waited so long!
While we're on the subject, I listed a great many sources on Russian history in my post. I have posted reviews on my web site. Have you read them? Search on Russia-Ukraine. Since they pretty much cover the waterfront, several are perforce by Russophiles such as Stephen Cohen. Please come at me with an informed opinion.
https://grahamseibert.substack.com/p/recovered-book-reviews
Why did they? Answer to me is that they did not. That's Russian propaganda, spread by the likes of Gonzalo Lira, Thomas Roeper, Patrick Lancaster and Graham Phillips. Russia is generous with such people.
The UN's OSCE observer group was not allowed to actually see what went on. Russia had been planning this war for a long time, and they fueled the conflict to give them a reason. Such shelling certainly did not serve Ukraine's interests. The ongoing conflict was likely to lead to war, which it did. Everybody know that war would be a disaster for Ukraine. They tried to avoid rather than invite it.
close friend of mine has a Ukrainian friend who now lives on Whidbey Island (that's in Washington State where I used to live) who immigrated from eastern Ukraine. He still has friends and family there. According to him, the bombing and shelling of eastern Ukraine by the Ukrainian military was real, he has heard about it from his friends and family who are there.
Russia did not want this war. They wanted a guarantee that Ukraine would not join NATO and they wanted to get the Nazi's out of Ukraine. And I suspect they also wanted to shut down the 26 biolabs that were in Ukraine.
US told Russia in 1991 that we would not move NATO one inch east of Germany. Guess how many NATO countries there are today that are east of Germany.
Tell me, what would US do if Russia installed missile bases in Canada just north of our border and China installed missile bases in Mexico just south of our border?
Here's an irony. I just got crapped on by Taras Kuzio, an ardent Ukrainian patriot and ardent American leftist. He told me to piss up a rope when I tried to interest him in answering Carlson's interview. I should be PO'd. However, it prompted me to reread my 2017 review of his book "Putin's War Against Ukraine." He called it a war in 2017, and it was. I suggest that you read this long review. It has stood the test of time.
http://www.grahamseibert.com/Reviews/Russia-Ukraine/Putins%20war%20against%20Ukraine.pdf
I challenge the notion that Russia did not want this war. They wanted the war in 2014 and this one as well. Read my review of Alexander Dugin's "Fourth Political Theory," link below. Russia is and has always been expansionist.
I and most of us did not thing NATO was a good idea for Ukraine. We were not close to joining. It is now a bad idea simply because there are no enemies other than Russia. Moreover, the EU is a bad idea. If the leaked dialog I see is correct, Putin quite rightly mocks it in his Tucker interview.
Ukraine of course had nothing to do with who was admitted to NATO. We still don't know the history of the biolabs. The Ukrainian people certainly did not know about them. They were a bad idea, but not a reason to go to war.
As to the shelling, I am sure that Ukraine shot back when provoked. They had total control over what the denizens of Luhansk and Donetsk heard on the news, so I'm not surprised that's what they believed. Russia has even been known to carry out false flag operations.
http://www.grahamseibert.com/Reviews/Russia-Ukraine/The%20Fourth%20Political%20Theory%20Alexander%20Dugin.pdf
"We have strong leadership" ??
Wise up you fool !!
War is Peace. Freedom is Slavery. Neocons Are Successful.
Short answer: No!
I think that Putin is NOT wanting the New World Order, so if there is a chance to weaken what Putin is, what he does, the NWO people will take it. Putin does not want to give his power over to the NWO people. Not that I think It is right that Putin invades other countries though, but this is about slamming Putin.
Well, the disaster for the Thousands of Tribes and Nations caused by the Anglo-Franco-Iberian viral load coming to this country has never been reckoned with. It just has been exported as pain and gain and theft and murder and enslavement by the AmeriKKKans and now those in the Wailing Wall White House.
Forget neo-con, neo-liberal. The average (what's that) American is gung ho! Don't you know?
Jobs producer, these wars. And, in the room temperature IQ of the average Yanqui, it is all part of their orgasm. Empire of death, terror, chaos, theft, misery.
Now have a good day!
https://paulokirk.substack.com/p/area-of-terror-plans-for-splitting
Uh, the first time you are learning of the plight of the farmer in Europe, Judge? Perhaps the judge should consider paying attention to alternative news sources. I'll bet Judge Napolitano has since realized that this was one of those tellingly-embarrassing admissions of the unacceptably uninformed, at least on some important topic. (I have done it myself. It does not feel good.)
Back to the principal topic, my heart is absolutely breaking. If, or rather when, we survive this--and that will not come without great suffering--we must figure out how to prevent plutocrats from gaining the power that they currently do---the power that we have permitted them to have. Their initial turn into solipsism self-reinforcingly accelerated unimpeded into madness. Because we live in a partly material realm, there is momentum to these processes.
First their lost of reasoning becomes irrational according to accepted rules, mores and then legal and constitutional strictures. Their wealth allows them to think and to behave--without seeming consequences--"way outside the box." Then irrationality progresses to practical arationality once their own combined whims, impulses and desires for gratification (carnal or intellectual) become the only term in the numerator of all ratios, all benefit-to-cost analyses. As cost goes to the limit of zero, the fraction becomes undefined. They are living in a new economic realm, they become like transactional gods. The plutocrats' hope that their economic Olympian heights will magically encompass that of the biological.
It will not. Their magic is illusory. It would be wise that they not believe their own trickery. The apparent suspension of natural and Divine law merely tightens a giant spring. It is the spring of the Logos.
Most are brain dead politicians. There's your answer.
What! "This is the first I've heard...."
If that is true, and why lie about it, than I'm just gobsmacked. What am I doing knowing anything? Little ole' uneducated housewife me somehow has her own centralized intelligence agency in her head and it is a lonely place.